UHLMANN: We're joined now by the Finance Minister Penny Wong. Welcome.
WONG: Good evening.
UHLMANN: You said last year that our absolute priority is to return the budget to surplus. Is that still the case?
WONG: We understand the importance of a sound fiscal strategy. We knew that when we went into deficit to put stimulus into the economy which saved jobs, kept Australians off the dole queues. And we said at that time we will make sure we have a clear plan to return the budget to surplus. And that's what we're doing. We laid down a budget earlier this year that has us coming back to surplus in 2012-13 and we're determined to deliver on that plan.
UHLMANN: And it's your absolute priority?
WONG: What we've said is that we understand the importance of a sound fiscal strategy. Can I say it puts us in a very difficult position to that of Mr Abbott and Mr Hockey, who don't have any fiscal strategy. They have a $70 billion black hole, just to get to the starting line. Let's be clear: a $70 billion black hole. They have to find $70 billion worth of savings just to get to the starting line.
UHLMANN: Well let's deal with your surplus if we can. Why did you paint yourself into this corner? It was always only going to be a $3.5 billion surplus and yet you've made a rod for your own back.
WONG: Well, look, I don't accept the premise of the question. When we went through the global financial crisis, we laid out for Australians how we would deal with this. We'd put stimulus into the economy to keep people in work.And that's one of the reasons why we've come out of the global financial crisis in one of the best positions of any advanced economy in the world. But we also understood how important it was to lay out the plan to come back to surplus. And that's what we've done and that's what we did.
UHLMANN: And by making an iron-clad guarantee, if you failed to meet it, then you fail to meet your own mark and you're not good financial managers by your own measures.
WONG: Well, I don't agree with that.
UHLMANN: Well why did you set that mark?
WONG: I think we have demonstrated our credibility as financial managers by the virtue of the decisions we've made. And let's remember, we've made some hard decisions. We've made some hard decisions in the face of some difficult times. For example, in the last budget, $22 billion worth of savings.
It's very different to Mr Abbott. Mr Abbott always takes the easy option. He says he's going to do things, he promises people what he thinks they want to hear, but he doesn't make the hard decisions to ensure that you deliver sound fiscal policy.
UHLMANN: But again, why does this Government obsess about the Opposition? Why don't you just get on with governing? They're a long way from it at the moment. And you keep signing up to the measures that they want. They say that a good government delivers a surplus. You say, 'Yeah, we'll sign up to that'.
WONG: In the context of the debate on carbon, I'm surprised that you'd even suggest we sign up to what they want, Chris. I think we're very clear about what's required. I think really that question ought to be put to Mr Abbott. Remember in the budget how Mr Abbott said the family tax benefits save was class warfare, a war on aspiration, you know, beat his chest about all these things. What did he do when it went to the Parliament? He supported it. He voted for it.
UHLMANN: I guess now people are watching what the Government will do and they'll be watching the surplus very closely. But, look, let's move on.
WONG: And we've set out our plan. Costed, the budget, we made $22 billion worth of savings. UHLMANN: And if you don't hit your mark next year?
WONG: I've said to you we are working to that plan, we're determined to deliver it.
UHLMANN: Are you concerned that there's a slowdown on the way?
WONG: What I do know is this: we are seeing a lot of uncertainty in terms of the global economy, we're seeing a lot of volatility on markets, we've got obviously concerns in Europe and the United States. But I know two things: one is that we do have a track record of responding well to global uncertainty and I know that our economy is in a stronger position than almost any other advanced economy to weather this storm.
UHLMANN: What about our industrial relations system? It's less flexible than it was when we went through the last slowdown. The last time we went through a slowdown, it was a test of WorkChoices. This time it will be a test of Fair Work Australia.
WONG: What I'd say to you, Chris, is unlike Mr Abbott, unlike Tony Abbott and the Opposition, we don't think that the way to prosperity is to take away people's penalty rates and to reduce people's wages and conditions.
What do we face the current economic circumstances in the globe with? Very strong public finances, very strong financial institutions, strength in our region, the region continuing to go and very good, by global standards, a lot of people in employment, relatively low levels of unemployment and a very strong pipeline of investment. So whilst we're not immune, they're pretty good things to have behind you as you face the world.
UHLMANN: But if you push up penalty rates for small businesses, they are unable to compete on weekends in the way that they would like to, unable to open on the hours that they would like to and that's clearly what's beginning to happen across Australia with some small businesses.
WONG: And what I'd say to you is: we made clear as a party we don't think the way to secure Australia's future prosperity is to reduce people's wages and conditions.
UHLMANN: Are you concerned that Qantas and OneSteel are shedding jobs at the moment, that you might be seeing other companies shed jobs as well?
WONG: Of course we're all concerned about job losses. We're all -
UHLMANN: Do you think it's more likely now?
WONG: We're all concerned about job losses and we've been saying for some time we've got a lot of investment coming into this country, but we also have a lot of firms in sectors that are doing it tough.
And in fact if you look at the Budget, we talked about that. We talked about the patchwork economy, we talked about the fact that if you're in the mining sector, things were very good; if you're in a sector that was affected by the high dollar, things were pretty tough. And we are seeing these companies make these decisions for those commercial reasons.
UHLMANN: Your catchcry in 2007 was lifting productivity. Productivity is still appalling. You've had four years. Can you give us a time when we'll see an improvement in productivity under any of the policies that you propose?
WONG: We're making a lot of investment, putting a lot of investment into productivity-enhancing measures.
UHLMANN: And when will we see an outcome from that?
WONG: We have made investments in education and skills over the term of this government and the previous government.
And the reason is we understand that we have to ensure Australians have better skills, the skills the future economy needs and more flexible skills. And that's why there's been such an investment under this Prime Minister into education and we're making a very substantial investment into the NBN, which is the infrastructure of this century. That is about productivity.
UHLMANN: On one last issue, why did the Labor Party pay Craig Thomson's legal bills?
WONG: Chris, that's something you'd have to ask the administrative arm of the party. I'm not involved in those sorts of matters.
UHLMANN: Certainly, of course, but he was a private citizen when - or he's a member of the Health Services Union - not a member of the Labor Party at the time. Doesn't it strike people as just a touch unusual?
WONG: You should direct the question to the Labor Party itself.
UHLMANN: Penny Wong, we'll leave it there. Thank you.
WONG: Thank you.
ENDS