BEVAN: Good morning Senator Wong.
WONG: Good morning. Youre on your ownsome today?
BEVAN: On my ownsome today. Minister, I understand it you werent in the chamber yesterday when Nick Xenophon made his statement. He kept it to the very last minute. But whats your thoughts on a Senator using parliamentary privilege in this way?
WONG: Parliamentary privilege is a very powerful shield, isnt it? Parliamentarians do have the opportunity and the privilege of being able to be protected in what they say in Parliament. Its an important part of our democracy, but it has to be exercised wisely and with regard to any consequences which may ensue. I think every Senator and every Member of Parliament has to make their own judgment about what they say in Parliament and the extent to which they are wanting privilege to shield them from the consequences of things that they say.
BEVAN: So do you think he did the right thing?
WONG: I know Nick and I think Nick is a genuine man. I dont know enough about the details of this, obviously there are a lot of serious issues, a lot of allegations which are currently under investigation by the Church which have been made. But I would say, Im sure Nick thought very long and very hard about doing it. People will make their own judgement about whether he did the right thing or not.
BEVAN: Penny Wong, front page of the Financial Review. The headline is Treasury slams inefficient GST. Youre the federal Finance Minister, do you think the GST has become less robust and increasingly inefficient?
WONG: I think that there are always issues in your tax system, there are always things you need to make sure you consider. But what we have said is we will have the tax forum to consider a whole range of issues. But I think Australians are very clear about the way in which the GST operates, and the Treasurer has made clear were not proposing to alter that.
BEVAN: Right, so that means you can rule out, everyone can be quite happy with this, you are not going to increase the rate of the GST?
WONG: The Treasurer has made that very clear in terms of the Governments position. I know that there are different views amongst different people in the community, and some different industry groups, and I think also some members of Parliament but the Government has made its position clear on this.
BEVAN: So no increase in rate of the GST?
WONG: The Treasurer has made that clear previously.
BEVAN: You just have trouble saying that? There will be no can you say those words, there will be no increase in the rate of the GST?
WONG: (laughs) I love the way you put words to me David. The Treasurer has said were not altering the base nor the rate. Weve said that on many occasions.
BEVAN: The world wont come to an end if you say we will keep the tape, by the way, just in case something changes. But you can say, cant you - Im not going to change the rate of the GST?
WONG: Ive just said that David.
BEVAN: Not quite like that, but well keep the tape.
WONG: Ive said the Government has made it clear, we are not going to be changing the base, nor increasing the rate of the GST.
BEVAN: Okay, and youre happy with that. What about closing the leaks in the GST? The Fin Review reports $15 billion a year is leaking from the GST due to tax breaks on items such as health, education and housing.
WONG: I think that there are a whole range of issues in relation to health which we do need to consider. Theres certainly a lot of growth in terms of health funding. It doesnt seem to me that the GST is the way you deal with this. What we do need to do is to try and ensure we get our financing of health as a nation on a stable footing. Weve taken big steps in that, the Prime Minister achieved an agreement with the Premiers in relation to health reform, thats a good step. Weve got a long way to go. Weve still got our private health insurance saving to get through the Parliament. Thats very important, because
BEVAN: Are you looking to plug some of those tax breaks which are causing leaks to the GST, according to the Fin Review, of up to $15 billion a year?
WONG: Ive made clear already in this interview were not proposing to change the base nor the rate of the GST. And Ive also said, David, that I think there are many issues when it comes to funding health that are much bigger than the issue that youre raising.
BEVAN: This is quite a specific question, Minister. Are you looking at closing down tax breaks on such items as health, education, and housing?
WONG: Ive made clear were not putting forward changes to the GST, David. There are issues around the financing of health. There are much bigger issues than the one that youre raising, and one of them is making sure we get our private health insurance savings through the Parliament.
Can I explain what we have here. We have a lot of growth in funding of health over the decades to come because of the aging of the population. Were the party of Medicare, we want to make sure we continue as a nation to have a strong health system. But we do have to make some choices about how we fund that growth in expenditure. And thats why the Government is pressing ahead with the private health insurance changes that weve previously put into the Parliament, because we want to be able to use that money for some of these growth areas where we think it would be more effectively spent.
BEVAN: Right. But Rob Heferen, who is the Treasurys Executive Director of Revenue, is quoted in the paper as saying the GST was now also less than robust because households were spending more on tax-free items such as private health insurance, private schooling, and existing housing. So are those areas that you need to plug up so you can get more GST revenue? You might not be increasing the rate, but youll get more GST revenue because youre going to close down those breaks.
WONG: And what Im saying to you is that I think that there are other areas which are more important for parties of both political persuasions to address.
BEVAN: So the answers no?
WONG: Ill tell you what Im more worried about as a Finance Minister, and thats getting the private health insurance changes through the Parliament. Because theres billions of dollars there that we want to be able to ensure we can spend on health services that are currently spent subsidising people on high incomes. And I dont believe that its an efficient use of taxpayers money to be subsidising the private health insurance of people who are earning very high salaries. Id rather be putting that money into public hospitals and into other medical services.
BEVAN: Minister before you leave us, the carbon tax bills, I think that some 18 of them were introduced into the Parliament yesterday, and theyll be now debated over the next few weeks. But seriously, apart from a few MPs, I doubt whether all of them will work their way through the detail, theyll probably just vote along party lines. But apart from a few MPs and the industries directly affected, nobody else is going to know whats in those bills, are they? Its only a tiny, tiny fraction of the population who will ever know whats in the carbon tax bills. So really, the debate, youve just got to wait now to get the bills through and hope that the world doesnt come to an end and people will see that its not Armageddon. In terms of the strategy, dealing with the millions of people who will vote, dont worry about the detail of the bills, its just get it through and hope that they accept it. Because theyre not going to be sitting down and going through it clause by clause, are they?
WONG: I suppose there might be some people in Australia who go through clause by clause the bills that are in the Parliament, David, but not that many. But I dont think it would be fair to say that this hasnt been pretty heavily debated in the Australian community.
This is a debate weve been having for years, certainly since the late 90s. But more importantly, you might recall John Howard went to the 2007 election with a commitment to put a price on carbon through an emissions trading scheme. Weve had two elections in which this has been discussed. Weve had Parliament go through a whole process, when I was Climate Change Minister, of committees, of draft legislation. We had whats called a Green Paper and a White Paper, which are detailed policy papers the Government puts out, that forms a lot of those issues are included in the package which weve subsequently announced, which was negotiated through the multi-party committee, and has been announced for some time now by the Prime Minister.
So the bills, there might be a whole range of technical details, but the public policy issue is this: do we want to put a price on carbon so we can reduce pollution and shift our economy to a cleaner energy economy? If we do, we believe this is the most efficient way of doing it.
BEVAN: Penny Wong, thanks for talking to us.
WONG: Good to be with you.
ENDS