SPEERS: Thank you for your time.
WONG: Good to be here again.
SPEERS: Can you tell us what your sense is from this leadership battle. Its been ugly, its been messy, its been very damaging to the Labor brand already. Can Labor, whatever happens, really recover from this?
WONG: The only way we will be able to recover from it is if everybody ensures that this is resolved on Monday. And I again say I welcomed what the Prime Minister said about that. She said while she expected to be returned as the leader of the party, but if she were not re-elected that she would go to the backbench and renounce all claims on the leadership. The same commitment needs to be given by Kevin Rudd. We are a Labor Government. We are here to do good things for working Australians, we can only do that if we resolve this once and for all, on Monday.
SPEERS: Your colleague Nicola Roxon gave us an emphatic position this morning that she will not serve on the frontbench if Kevin Rudd returns to the leadership. Will you give that same commitment?
WONG: I did serve in Kevin Rudds cabinet, and I want to continue serving in Prime Minister Gillards cabinet. Ive made a judgement based on the time Ive spent under both leaders about who I think is best to govern the country. And that is why Im supporting Prime Minister Gillard.
GILBERT: Minister, its Kieran Gilbert here, what do you make of the suggestion by Nick Champion and others, but certainly Nick Champion this morning, just a few moments ago that hes essentially stood down, resigned as secretary of the Caucus. He says, prompted by the tactics used by some of your senior colleagues in attacking Kevin Rudd. He says its unacceptable and counterproductive. What do you say to that?
WONG: Nick can speak for himself but I would note that Kevin Rudd himself said, its time for plain talking. Its unsurprising that some people have felt it was important to put on the public record things that people knew privately, but held their tongue in the best interests of the party.
But again, what I say is this: we have to get through Monday, and then we have to ensure that Monday is the end of this. Our job, as a Labor Government, is to put through the reforms. Things like the disability reforms, the skills reforms, ensure we invest in superannuation from the mining tax. These sorts of reforms for the future, thats what our job is. And we need to get on with it from Monday.
GILBERT: Well, whats the prospect of that, seriously, when you look at just how messy this has been. Can you remember a leadership battle as bloody and public as this?
WONG: I suspect I probably would have been asked that before in the context of leadership disputes. Theyre never easy, are they? But, we do get through them. And I think what we have to remember that this is not about personalities. This is about who is the best person to run the country.
Theres been a lot of talk today about cabinet processes. Theres no doubt that the reason we have good processes is because we want to deliver good government, and theres no doubt in my mind that we have a much more disciplined and methodical process of government and implementation under Prime Minister Gillard.
SPEERS: Penny Wong, everyones talking about everything now, all gloves are off in relation to what happened under Kevin Rudd. So let me ask you now, something youve been asked many times but not answered. The carbon emissions trading scheme. Did you urge Kevin Rudd to push ahead for a double dissolution on this, and did Julia Gillard argue him to shelve it, and did Kevin Rudd dither on this question?
WONG: I am not one, as you know, notwithstanding your introduction, to go through chapter and verse detail of what occurred previously. I would say what Ive just said, that I think good processes of government are about making sure you deliver good government for Australians, and that the process is far better now under Prime Minister Gillard than what we previously saw.
SPEERS: This was a very important policy matter
WONG: And what Id say to you David is Kevin Rudd himself, on Q& A, has said he was uniquely responsible for that decision as Prime Minister of the time. That is what he has said
SPEERS: Sure but what about your position, and Julia Gillards position. This is crucial.
WONG: David can I say, I have always been consistent in my argument for a price on carbon. Always. I would say to you about Prime Minister Gillard, it is one thing to talk about climate change being an enormous challenge. It is another thing to deliver the price on carbon that everybody said was necessary. And that is what Prime Minister Gillard did that
SPEERS: But
WONG: ...in a minority Government, and not having the numbers in the House of Representatives, so
SPEERS: But did she argue for the CPRS
WONG: And I think that stands by its belt. It is a demonstration of her commitment on this issue.
SPEERS: But did she argue for the CPRS to be shelved back in 2010.
WONG: Im not going to go through this because theres many things that get discussed in Cabinet, or in Cabinet committees. And my view is that those things should stay within Cabinet. Weve seen in recent times
SPEERS: Thats not the view of your colleagues this week.
WONG: Well, theres been also a lot of destabilising that Ive observed in the media, and Im sure you have too, about what might or might not have been said in Cabinet in recent months. That is the sort of lack of discipline that needs to be put to bed on Monday.
SPEERS: So its fair enough for everyone to reveal Kevin Rudds poor behaviour in Cabinet, but not anything critical of Julia Gillard.
WONG: What Im saying is that I think good government does require sensible decision making and proper Cabinet processes. And I see that we have been much improved on that front under Prime Minister Gillard.
SPEERS: Senator Wong I want to ask you another thing about Nick Champions comments this morning saying that it was up to the ministers of the time to stand up to Kevin Rudd if it was dysfunctional, if he was being a micromanager, if they werent getting a say, to stand up to him in the caucus. Doesnt the Prime Minister, the Treasurer, and in fact yourself and your other Cabinet colleagues who have come out bagging Kevin Rudd, own some of the responsibility as well, instead of going to the lengths that you went to, that you should have just stood up to him in the first place?
WONG: Theres no doubt Cabinet has a responsibility to ensure good government. And I suspect one of the reasons youre seeing a number of Cabinet Ministers coming out and putting their views now is that they do feel a responsibility to explain to the caucus why theyre supporting Prime Minister Gillard. Ive made my judgement and this is not about personalities. My view is you need to think about who do you think is the best person to be Prime Minister? Who has the temperament, who has the character, who has the determination and the discipline? And my view is that person is Prime Minister Gillard.
SPEERS: When you say the temperament, did you find Kevin Rudds demeanour inappropriate at times, like Wayne Swan has said he was? You worked very closely with him.
WONG: All of us I think at times find each other challenging. I dont want to go into those details. What I will say is drawing on my experiences Ive made a choice about who I am supporting. And I am supporting Prime Minister Gillard. I think she is the person who can look to the future and bring a determination to these decisions that we need to make. She also has had the tenacity to deliver some pretty difficult reforms, the mining tax and carbon price, things that eluded us previously.
SPEERS: Penny Wong were getting people on Twitter saying that you should be the one instead coming through the middle here, youre in the Senate so thats not going to happen, so I just thought Id pass that on. Can I ask you though, what sign is there that things are going to improve if you stick with Julia Gillard? And weve heard now a conga line of MPs and ministers saying we need to go to Rudd. Hes the only one who can win us the election. Has there been any signal that things are going to change if you stick with Julia Gillard, that things are going to improve?
WONG: I think its interesting, isnt it? On the one hand we want Labor to be less poll-driven, we want Labor to focus on good reforms for the nation. And on the other hand were told that no, we actually have to only look at polls when making this decision. What do I think we need to do to be a good Labor Government, a better Labor Government? We need to continue to focus on not just the reforms we have delivered, which are substantial, but we need to continue to reform for the future, be focused on the future. Be focused on the future. We need to deliver good government, and to be competitive at the next election we also need to be unified. Those are the things I think we need to focus on. And Monday needs to be the end of this.
SPEERS: Alright, Finance Minister Penny Wong, well leave it there. Thank you for joining us today.
WONG: Good to be with you.
ENDS